hackthis_archive | Why is it the ones we love we can't trust?

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Current Music: Doves 'Someday Soon'

Why is it the ones we love we can't trust?

The only thing better than one night of insomnia is TWO nights of insomnia.

Also, I am turning off all phones on Monday night now, because clearly, even getting texts about what I'll be seeing (without spoilers) is totally setting me off.

THE BAD

I'll say up front I'm completely disappointed in the Nathan-as-Claire's father arc. Crushed. Bitter. Hella angry. Vexed. Thinking about the claw marks on the ceiling and the shoe through TV. Pick one. And now allow me to tell you why:

a) The whole writers paean to cheerleaders thing urks me. Always has. Whether it's on Smallville or Friday Night Lights or Heroes the whole 'Isn't the cheerleader the best thing since sliced bread?!' has always irritated the crap out of me. Maybe it's an American thing I just don't get. Maybe it's all that displaced writer geeky anger about never getting the cheerleader in high school that I just think 'Fucksakes! Get over it!' I really should've known Heroes wouldn't be different – in fact it went to a whole new level with 'Save the Cheerleader, Save the World!'

Man, save me a barf bag.

b) I don’t like Claire. I really just don't. I'm sure the actress is lovely, but as a character I just cannot be bothered. In fact, I feel this way about ALL the actresses on Heroes. There's too much pigeon-holing. Too many archetypes. Oooh, look at the psycho bitch (Jessica)! Oooh, look at the sainted wife (Heidi AND Niki)! Look at the loopy mom (Angela AND Mrs. B) and at the devoted torn girlfriend (Simone) and at the cheating bitch (Mrs. Parkman)!

Apparently nobody told the Heroes writers that women could be more than saintly or psychotic. Go figure.

c) This is an uncharacteristically stupid move on Nathan's part. I don’t care that it was fifteen/sixteen years ago, when chances are he was probably at basic training in Texas and they prolly met at a bar, blah blah blah, fill it in yourselves. He is a Petrelli. You really expect me to believe he doesn't know what a condom is?

d) I think I might've accepted this maybe just a smidgen more if they hadn't been so fucking OBVIOUS about it. The arm across the desk (only Adrian Pasdar could have a sexy wrist, just saying), Claire talking about how she hoped her bio-parents lived in a big penthouse in New York, Pyro!Mama talking about all her travels (you know it couldn't have been on her own dime). I mean, Jesus, make sure the anvil doesn't get your toes on the way down.

e) It was so friggin obvious, I thought 'No, surely not. Nobody is that obvious!' But I was fucking wrong, wasn't I? And I'd developed such a good theory. Damn you, Tim Kring, for fucking me over without protection! In sixteen years our kid is going to coming look for your ass!

e) Overall, I just. You know. No. I will say however that it's a shame you can't kill the cheerleader off, because I would totally take Pyro!Mama anyday. She cracks my shit up. AND – she's real.

THE GOOD

1) Hiro was awesome. I have no issue there. The fact that Ando has a crush (a displaced one) on Hiro's sister cracks my shit up.

2) Oh, Peter, bless you and your emo-ness. Claude, bless you for being an arrogant ass. I didn't get it the first two episodes Claude was there -- I confess. He was an arrogant prick. He was mean to Baby!Emo!Peter. I don't love Peter, but I don't like anybody being mean to him either except Nathan. And then last night it hit me –- Claude is Peter's new Nathan! Claude is the new awesome asshole! And then he pushed Peter off the roof and my brain said, 'Dude, how many times have I wanted to do that? I am so jealous!' I thought he was going to fly. What happened was about fifty times better.

3) Angry!Puppy!Peter is actually kinda hot. *feels moment of shame* *is so over it.*

4) Emo!hair mockery! HAHAHAHAHA Claude, you are made of awesome.

5) And then he bitch!slapped Peter when he went crazy emo again! Claude = <3. I see this now.

6) Where is the missing scene where Peter goes to hone his invisibility control by spying on Nathan. Don't lie! We know it's there and involves nudity!

7) Did I mention the part about Adrian Pasdar having a sexy wrist? Did I mention how much he's totally improved with age? Hot damn. He'll be the first one in when I get that cloning machine working.

THE SPIN! THE SPIN!

* So, Peter doesn't just pick up powers when he's around people he fucking acquires them, huh?. Oh. Well, that's a new and crazily awesome twist. So, Peter really can be anybody. He can fly. He can regenerate. He can become invisible. What's missing here then?

That he can go back and forwards in time.

Oh, I think somebody's going to be making a trip back in time to see his big brother when he was young and stupid and a little more sexually open-minded. (Yes, that is my next story idea).

* Next week there is a lot of Nathan action. Nathan in sunglasses! Nathan getting out of a car! Nathan looking hotass! That I can live with.

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I LOVE YOUR NEXT STORY IDEA. LOVE.

Also, am VERY VERY FOND of Claude these days.

Though, dude, how and why did Peter decide Claude had control over his powers and could teach him? Were there ANY hints in canon about that?

As far as I am concerned (don't hurt me) this whole show is like, the Hiro and Claude show. Everyone else is a side plot. *cowers before your Petrelli-induced righteousness* But, you know, that's what makes a good ensemble show - one or two characters you can't live without, and a cast of others that aren't too objectionable. Freakishly enough, this fandom is CRAZY for Niki and Claire. Like, I went icon-hunting through

ninth_wonders yesterday trying to find one of Hiro brandishing the sword in front of the dinosaur skeleton (nothing really clear, WTF fandom) and it was all Claire, and Niki, and some Peter. Clearly, these people are tuning in to a whole different part of the show...

Oh, I think somebody's going to be making a trip back in time to see his big brother when he was young and stupid and a little more sexually open-minded. (Yes, that is my next story idea).

OMGDSHGKSHDKJdskljfadlksd.

(That was a yes please. My brain just died a little. That is so wrong and so right and I'm jealous I didn't think of it first.)

Also, if you haven't already, do yourself a favor and pause on Nathan picking up the phone in the preview, with the wrist, and the watch and the pen, and dear GOD his hands and wrist give me vapours.

And YES, when Claude pushed Peter off the building I was like: wow, someone's finally succumbed to that temptation, but I bet he wasn't the first person who wanted to. Even though I love Peter more than I ought, he NEEDED that.

I love Adrain Pasdar and yes, he has improved with age. I loved the twist with the re-Peter's powers - coolness. Didn't much mind the idea that Claire is Nathan's kid and the revelation was a surprise to me. Immediately followed with an 'of course!' ITA about the cheerleader fixation in American culture - I just don't get it. Landry on FNL is so much more interesting than Lyla and he and Riggins actually have chemistry, unlike the prop up doll Minka Kelly.

Back to Heroes. Zach irritates me, just lose him.

I just kind of just stick my head in the sand about the terrible depiction of women in Heroes (I might vaguely try to defend Claire, but I understand your point). I feel a bit guilty about it, but then I think about Nathan and I'm mostly okay with it.

There had better be some sort of Claude/Nathan smackdown in which they fight over Peter. And Nathan is shirtless. That's the key part.

I am totally in favor of some sort Peter/Claude/Nathan dirty wrongness with added bonus of invisibility, but
Oh, I think somebody's going to be making a trip back in time to see his big brother when he was young and stupid and a little more sexually open-minded. (Yes, that is my next story idea).
works too.

Also, the reason I'm so excited about Nathan being Claire's father is that it elimated a potential romance on the show, and I love this show so very much for all the hotness and awesomeness and also hotness it has given me, but they cannot do romance at all. Seriously, I'd be in favor of everyone being related and no romance ever.

And I wrote fic! But it's sad and has no porn, so it doesn't really count.

You know the first thing Best Friend said last night is Zahra's gonna be *so pissed*.

Hee hee hee.

We know the baby girl well.

Also, check out her fabulous new icon when she inevitably shows up in this entry. It says Petrellicest--not just for the boys, anymore.

Mwuahahahaha.

I was very disappointed that they had Nathan be Claire's dad. This could have been a great oppurtunity to introduce a new character. I had hoped her father would have been one of the 'old' heroes like Claude.

<3 Claude is the new black. Or maybe Peter is the little black dress, he just goes with anything. Srsly, can the guy not do a scene without looking like he's about to make out with his costar? I should not find a bloody, pulpy, pushy, Peter--p'p'pah'-- so equally amusing and hot. *sigh* Kring.

;)

I agree on the much abused cheerleader-archtype in TV [and I didn't mean for that to come out as pun in regards to Claire *g*] but in her character's defense--and Kring's-- I don't think he is using the whole role of the cheerleader in any glorified way. Unless you're talking about gore in the horror-flick-cliche sense, he is so doing that.

In the case of Claire as a person, though, Kring writes her in the first 4 ep-story arc as wanting to be a cheerleader as a means to fit in and feel normal/accepted/popular. She also expresses to her Dad that she knows its superficial and that she's grown away from those group of girls she was once close with. She bluntly says that she's worried about "becoming a bitch". Her renewed relationship with Zach during that story arc also pushes her perception of friends and cliques.

Claire is not my favorite character [still isn't] and I empathize with you if you had fast-forwarded through her scenes in the early part of the series. Her premise didn't interest me and initial scenes didn't hook me at all, but because the show has such an intwined storyline, I went back and found things mentioned in her dialogue that kind of flesh her out beyond idolized/helpless TV cheerleader. If you can stand to watch her earlier storyline again [In your case, I recommend a stick or a leather wallet to bite down on] it might help your acceptance of her as a character.

I know you want to vomit up your own head with disgust right now, but Mom #1 and I talked about this last week after the promo and we thought, yes, perhaps they will make Nathan Claire's daddy, but won't it be worth it when Nathan discovers incontrovertible proof that Peter is actually Linderman's son... and he destroys it? Peep? Hope?

I totally love your next story idea. Do it. Because I'm in the camp that thinks Nathan being Claire's father is REALLY stupid, too.

I was at a panel at school last night where we screened the episode and then Tim Kring, Hiro, and a couple of the other writers were there to talk about it, and the question I mostly wanted to ask was "WHY? WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS? THIS WAS A BAD, BAD IDEA. BAD." (I'm really glad I didn't text you, though. I thought about it and then realized you probably hadn't seen it and I hate it when people do that shit to me.)

Apparently nobody told the Heroes writers that women could be more than saintly or psychotic. Go figure.

I think that tends to be something that occurs a lot in comics, and most of the Heroes writers come from the comic world. I mean, back when I was more into comics, I read a couple books with really great female characters - Emma Frost, Snow, Death, etc. But on the whole, the comic world is a TOTAL Madonna/whore world, and that seems to have crossed over to here, too. Claire's pretty much the only one I consider a strong female character, and it took her awhile to grow on me.

Peter getting thrown off the roof made up for a lot with me, though. "I COULD HAVE DIED!" "Well, you could have FLOWN." Oh Claude, you are made of awesome.

I have missed this entire season of Heroes (new job on Mondays), but i don't feel like reading long recaps on TWoP. (Stupid non-working torrents!)

Who's Claude?

And, at least (hopefully), the Peter/Claire shipping can end.

I totally agree. Claude is awesome, Peter is hot and Kring is SO wrong to have made Nathan be Claire's father! I thought that because they made it SO obvious in the previews that it was Nathan, that they wouldn't go that way, but they did. Words cannot express the wrongness.

And now the two biggest ships for the show are cesty. Unbelievable. Somewhere, Kring is laughing.

I am so shocked by the negative reactions to the reveal! I was so fervently praying that Nathan would be Claire's dad I was actually shouting out loud with glee when I saw it wasn't just a red herring. Why? Because the absolutely best stories (and by best I mean the most sick and wrong and hot) I've seen in this fandom were Nathan/Peter/Claire with Claire being Nathan's daughter. I mean the 'cestiness on this show is off the scales! The fanfic possibilities this opens up absolutely rock my world. Not to mention how much more screentime this is going to mean for my favorite magnificent bastard. Hopefully people will come around to this idea and the LJs will be flooded with 3-way Petrelli smut. I'll just be here with my fingers crossed.

Ahhh. I feel ya. Here's a little something for us all to hope for...maybe Nathan being in her life will actually make her character kick a little more ass. ;-)

I like Heroes girls but their storylines are getting tad dull to me as the show progresses. Niki was more awesome when I didn't really know much about her character. Claire, yeah, this new twist amuses me because of the "hi, welcome to incestville!" twist on fandom favourite Peter/Claire ship. Still, it hasn't really sunk in yet. Some are saying it's a red herring, I don't know about that but it is weird. Of course, people always over-theorize Heroes.. Now people are also claiming Peter's adopted, handily removing all incest aspects of the show in one neat brush.

I really dig Claude, bastard though he may be to Emo!Peter. Your New Nathan theory rings very true and Peter's powers are currently the coolest in the show, IMO.

Hiro and Ando - consistently bringing the funny. "Did you put on cologne?", heh. Hiro's sister was kickass, too. I also had no idea Hiro's dad owned the company he worked at.

I'm not on board with Nathan-as-the-father either. Maybe some day, but it's just a lame horrible twist that explains the "science" even LESS than it did originally. Like what--the Flying Man and the Firestarter give birth to... Invincible Girl? Is there ever going to be a common point between all the Heroes? Why is Peter so special? SO MANY QUESTIONS.

I'm actually a fan of many of the women--Niki and Simone being notable exceptions. Claire's story is interesting and I give the actress credit for delivering some truly awful lines this week.

Claude is growing on me steadily.

I really should've known Heroes wouldn't be different – in fact it went to a whole new level with 'Save the Cheerleader, Save the World!'

I've just been chalking it up to Claire being from Texas, where they are crazynutspsycho about the awesomeness of cheerleaders. Coupled with the things

gene_lee pointed out upthread and my love of the irony of the cheerleader (blonde, usually considered vapid, inconsequential, and weak) being indestructible. Plus, unlike other teen characters in some shows I don't watch anymore *coughsmallvillecough*, Claire can dissemble and lie without giving away the game. Which I love, and also means she's totally Nathan's daughter. *g*

I have lots of reasons I'm okay with the development, but most of them are centered around the story possibilities they open up for the show. There's also the fact that I don't ship any pairings on Heroes, just individual characters, so I wasn't invested in Peter/Claire.

It does, however, bring up the age-old issue of authorial/actorly intent vs. fan interpretation, because according to this TV Guide interview, Kring always had Nathan as Claire's biological father, and both Pasdar and Panettiere have known about it for a long time. (Interview contains spoilers for future episodes.) And Ventimiglia seems to have known about it before the pilot aired. (No spoilers in that second one.) Specifically about Peter and Claire, TV Guide asked the big question:

TV Guide: Wasn't there a hint of a romantic spark between Claire and Peter? Now that we know they're related, it's kinda creepy.
Kring: That wasn't my intention, but I can see why some viewers took it that way. You get two very attractive young people on screen together, and people naturally go there. She looked to him as a hero, her knight in shining armor, and I think people translated that into romance. But it wasn't ever the plan. First of all, there's the age thing: Claire is 16 years old, and Peter is a good 10 years older. And now that he's her uncle, it changes everything.

So... I don't know. Part of me thinks this is an object lesson about not becoming attached to your interpretation of characters, which, yeah: HELLA BITCHY on my part, and easy to say because of my aforementioned lack of investment in Peter/Claire. Maybe it's because I'm so m/m slash-oriented: my pairings *never* become canon, so I've never had a pairing cut out from under me quite like this.

Hmmm. I feel like this comment is both way too long and paradoxically not explanatory enough of my thoughts. But I can't talk anymore, because I have to eat dinner before class. Stupid real life. *kicks desk*

Okay, now I *have* to friend you, for the arglefargle Nathan-is-Claire's-dad stuff. (And for the awesome fics, of course. *g*)

I mean, I'll adapt, and

trollprincess has written a fic that could even make me like certain ways it could have played out, but my initial and still lasting reaction is similar to yours.

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