hackthis_archive | Goddamn, that was racist.

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Goddamn, that was racist.

I want to start this post by saying a) I do not participate in Supernatural fandom b) I am a black person c) I have not read the story that started this week's Race Fail Brouhaha -- and let's be honest, it is only TWF (This Week's Fail, because that's just how this works). But I did read the informative post made by

bossymarmalade. And trust me. That was plenty.

I have also read subsequent posts both on my reading list and in the (very) wide fandom universe. Some have made me so blind with rage I've had to go outside. And some, like this one from

tevere and the one she linked to by

facetofcathy have made me go, "Thank you, ladies, you are better people than I, because mostly I think 'The more things change, the more nothing changes what. so. ever.'"

And I say all this to say:

I am a Person of Color. I am not your Racism Police.

Nor is any other Person of Color your Racism Police.

We were not put here to tell you when you are being a racist asshole. We are not here to be the back drop for your great romance. We are not a fucking background. We are PEOPLE. We are born, we live, we love, we die. We bleed just the same as any. body. else.

Just because you may not encounter a PoC in your daily life does not mean we are tiny people living in your TV that only start dancing around for your entertainment.

People of Color are not here for your entertainment.

We are not here to be your plot points or to be your One Minority Friend That Proves That You Are Totally. Not. A. Racist.

We are not birds. We are not exotic.

Our cultures. Not exotic.

So every time you ask to touch our hair because it looks different, or rub our skin as though the color might come off; and every time you ask what extraction we are, where our parents are from (implying that we obviously are "not from around here") or say we're pretty since we're mixed;

Every time you think, "These people are so *other* from me they must need a good white person to save them," -- and you know who you are (especially you, Hollywood) -- you are being a racist dick.

Point of fact, however, you don't have to be white to be racist. Anybody can be a racist. In fact, every time there's one of these Race Fail Tempests you inevitably get people asking, "Well, how am I supposed to know when I'm being racist?"

If you have to ask if you are being a racist, do I have to finish the rest of this sentence?

We are not small-eyed, thick-accented, Spanglish speaking or dark-skinned just to give you something to talk about. To give you something to compare yourself to and find yourself superior. We are not here for your artistic merit.

I don't care if your feelings are hurt today, I will still be a Person of Color tomorrow.

And yet, this still isn't going to change anything. It never changes anything. And why does it never change anything? Because people are making this into a theoretical discussion when it's not. These are people. Real fucking people. And these things really happened. And they caused a lot of fucking tragedy. The earthquakes? They happened. Colonialism? It happened. Blood diamonds. They happen. The wiping out of entire cultures by a bunch of greedy explorers. War in the name of oil or minerals (heads up, Afghanistan), the new land or spices or genocide. That shit happened. It keeps happening. It was not made up by six white guys in a air-conditioned office on the Warner Brothers back lot in Burbank drinking Diet Coke.

These things are happening now. And they will keep on happening. And just because they haven't happened to you in particular does not make them any less true, any less valid, or there to be exploited just for your amusement.

So I'm going to save the rest of my breath to cool my porridge and let Dave Chappelle say it best, because truly, "you ever have something happen that was so racist, that you didn't even get mad, you were just like, DAMN, that was racist."

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Man. The only thing I have to offer is the mp3 for Dave's whole 'Killing Them Softly' set here, if you don't already have it.

We are not birds. We are not exotic.

Our cultures. Not exotic.

That's an excellent shorthand for it, right there.

I usually lurk here (and everywhere else, really) but I will de-lurk to say thank you. For putting some eloquence to what I was thinking, as a PoC and as a citizen of the world.

death threats aside (which I don't support, and I think it is lowering yourself on the same level) even if she didn't mean it..it still hurts people..and if she is allowed to speak her mind..then so are we

I myself am a PoC from Afghanistan and come from a Muslim family...me and my family have endured a lot..hearing people talk about you (because of course if one does something wrong...the whole country and or the whole religion is wrong) on the media.. around you in a negative sense..and your neighbors not talking or even saying hi to you anymore because yeah you are muslim and you will blow someone up...nobody who hasn't endured it knows how it feels...and although I don't condone what the others do(death threats or whatever) I will speak my mind..because what she does is not right either.. and you would think that in the 21st century people would have a bit more sense and know more

I think you've endured especially difficult trials, because of the situation of conflict and the negative stereotypes, reinforced by the fact that one or another aspect of it is always in the news. In that poor girl's case, the little I've seen shows stupid stereotypes, but nothing negative - her Haitian characters are secondary & supporting characters, which is hurtful, drawn with a mere cut 'n paste of old clichés, which denies them individuality; but they are all portrayed sympathetically and positively (if badly, because, let's face it, she's no Hemingway.) I think the difference matters, especially when there are comments that suggest she commit suicide, threats, etc.

this makes me happy somehow...people objecting to the fuck up that is the modern citizen these days

Nobody here, of course, but plenty on LJ. Now imagine receiving literally thousands of angry comments, some telling you to commmit suicide, some threatening you. I think the sheer numbers, born of the the me-too-ism that led to the current unpleasant situation, has now passed into abuse. Cyberbullying someone for a mistake (as opposed to ill-intent) is NOT the way to go.

She should know the difference, it's stereotyping that makes people ignorant and scared of what they don't know and when that happens they follow the mass because lets face it..people will always follow the mass like stupid little sheep's who run at the smallest bark..

I don't see any death threats or suggestions of suicide here, people who think, know better but like I said I am against that. But I don't see any here so I don't really think you can apply it here=)

bl_nt and several other people have stated repeatedly no one in this post has threatened this person nor condoned the threats against her. I don't even see how that is relevant to this post, except as an attempt to elicit sympathy for this person, which you will not find here.

Edited 2010-06-17 15:15 (UTC)

Well, by "here" I mean LJ, which is interconnecting. But following the mass in piling on that girl while saying "we're all reasonable here"..."I'm not the one saying horrible things," which indeed you are not, has a cumulative mob effect which coupled with the real threats is simply too much. Individualism is not enough, one should be aware of the consequences of all accusing at the same time, relentlessly, one single person, and act responsibly.

But following the mass in piling on that girl while saying "we're all reasonable here"..."I'm not the one saying horrible things," which indeed you are not, has a cumulative mob effect which coupled with the real threats is simply too much.

So what you're implying is that no one should say anything and let her go about her business of perpetuating stereotypes? That we should all be quiet and let racism persist because she's upset that more than one person objects to what she's saying. Well I object to that. I am not going to schedule a time to discuss something that offends me right now. I am not going to stand in line and wait to get my say. And I believe if other people are offended they have the right to speak up now as well.

No, I have given up eliciting sympathy, because you're all doing the groupthink thing here, all saying the same worthy thing and cyberpatting one another on the back. After a bit, it does NOT matter if you're right.
I always meant LJ, not this or that thread - my flist is full of them, from all corners; surely you know how things propagate themselves? LJ is interconnected, and unless posts are private or flocked, it all resonates. I am pleading for a modicum of responsibility, because each single drop adds to a torrent. Up to you to decide whether you'll just follow the current or wish to think for yourself about consequences.)

Child, are you out of your goddamned mind?

I am pleading for a modicum of responsibility, because each single drop adds to a torrent.
The fact that you have absolutely no awareness of the irony of you saying this makes me want to cry or possibly punch something.

I am not implying; I am saying very clearly that the first two or three dozen posts were okay and right, and now too much is too much. Let her go about her business??? The first twenty posts - and these 20 posts were well-founded - ensured that she wouldn't ever again. Quiet? The place has been talking about nothing but this for 24 hours. You don't write in a vacuum. You would NEVER have read this fic if you hadn't already followed the wank. This post - one of many, most far more unreasonable than yours - has added a dozen more participants to it. Whoever, at this stage, after the first legitimate reactions, doesn't write their thoughts in a private, or at least flocked, post fuels the fire. If the kid offs herself**, every Monday morning quarterback here* here will be co-responsible.

* On LJ
** You think it's impossible?

No, YOU have no awareness of the irony - you are using precisely the techniques you rightly fear.

Maman? That you? I never knew you were on LJ! You can't even use a computer! And you don't speak English!

First of all, this is my LJ this is not the entire LJ universe. So don't say 'you' as though I am a sole offender and then back track and say you are speaking in generalities.

Second of all, this entire post is from my point of view as a Person of Color. I am stating my point of view. I am offended and I am not going to sit around feeling sorry for someone who brought this on themselves. This is not group think this is my opinion as an individual. You may not like it, but I'll be damned if I'll let you try to make it invalid, just because you feel sorry for that writer.

I am not doing anybody's thinking but my own. I am not following anybody's "current" but my own and I am truly offended that you would imply otherwise. We are clearly not going to see eye to eye on this. Ever.

So, now my post is unreasonable. My feelings are unreasonable. But according to you, your point and feelings are completely valid. Wow, that sounds a lot like someone trying to avoid a conversation on racism by calling the feelings of offense invalid.

This conversation is over.

Please leave my Live Journal and do not come back.

Flounce, flurry, out.

See, most of the people hurting others have been hurt first themselves; you illustrate the point. At NO POINT have I said that you weren't right, or that your feelings weren't valid. I was saying that you now were adding to something beyond you, but very real too. You do not want to see that. Instead you are creating an offence where none was made. I should actually now be offended in turn, since you are now implying ugly things about me. I am actually rather sad, because you take it all as a zero-sum game. It is possible that both of us are right, but perish the thought that you would try to see things from any other angle. You are poorer by it.

(Actually I meant that your post wasn't unreasonable*, as opposed to others, but I can see it is not clearly said. Sorry if it was misconstrued.)

*Your answers, now...

We are not birds. We are not exotic.

Our cultures. Not exotic.

Yes. This. I knew a guy in college who -- among other offensive things -- would act as though my Mexican-American background was a novelty. I could never quite articulate to him why I hated it, other than to try and say, "Yes, my cultural background may be different than yours but its still not something to treat like a new and shiny object."

Hi. I got here via via-ostiense (http://via-ostiense.dreamwidth.org/).

I just want to add a WORD and an EXACTLY and some relief at how well you've said all these, because reading it and offering my support goes a little ways towards feeling like I've expressed this myself. I did my own post a couple of days ago and ranted a little bit in it, but that post has morphed into a sort of link roundup/hub for this whole fandom discussion, and while I've been spending a lot of my angry energy managing links and updates and comments, I wish I'd gotten even madder and said even more, because I still have all these thoughts and feelings boiling in my brain. You just... you said what I wish I'd said, and you said it really well. Thank you.

Um. My post is here (http://amazonziti.livejournal.com/52274.html). As people keep writing, I keep updating. I'm going to add this post to my list of links the next time I update; if you'd rather not be linked to, just let me know and I'll take your link down.

"If I suck, let me know, but it is in no way your responsibility to tell me, just know that I won't be offended or angry but will probably say 'thank you' and change it or at least try to discuss it with you. I won't do a non-apology apology, or tell you you hurt my little feelings or whatever, because I am a grown-ass woman and I can deal with being an imperfect product of an imperfect society and also, am a person who should self-monitor and may have failed and would like to hear your thoughts."

I think this is a wonderful idea. (Made more eloquent or left as-is!)

Thank me? Well, thank you. I had heard about your epic post for a day or two (you notice how a day or two around here is more like dog years?) and I went there to see what you were doing and ended up reading your responses to quite a few anonymous comments that were... less than savory shall we say? You handled yourself beautifully, told people where to stick it when they needed to stick it somewhere, offered some guidance where it was needed and offered a safe haven where sometimes you don't feel like there is one. So, again, *thank you*.

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