I have to say this before I explode.

[hackthis_archive]

Being in fandom is like being in a relationship. Sometimes you are stupidly in love (emphasis on the 'stupid'). Sometimes you are in loathing. Sometimes you are thinking about felonies, sometimes you are thinking about tattoos. And as with every relationship, it's important to communicate. How are people gonna know how you feel if you don't say something, so here is me communicating about podfics.


I have a strict no-podfic policy regarding my work. I know people love podfics. I know people enjoy making them and listening to them, and more power to you. I am not pissing on your parade. Hell, there's a podfic of TRADE that I approved two years ago, but based on experiences since then I don't allow my stuff to be podficced. That's my decision and people have respected that, and for that, I am very grateful.

Why am I grateful? Because people are displaying manners and being thoughtful. They are fucking asking first. How hard is it to ask first? Seriously?

Based on my experiences (and those of people I talk to), I would say 95% of the people who read or record podfics are lovely, well-mannered people who talk to the authors and ask if they can record their stories and whatever the author says, they do.

This isn't about those people.

This is about the people who do not ask permission.

This is about the people who go ahead and record somebody else's story and then ask after the fact if it's cool if they post them since they already appropriated somebody else's work without permission and now they've got this story that they just have to share since they did all this work and they badger the author to give them permission even though they never asked permission in the first fucking place.

Ladies and gentlemen, THAT IS NOT COOL.

How would you feel if I came to your house while you were out and took some of your jewelry or your shirts or your favorite shoes and wore them around and then came back later when you were home and said, "Oh, hai! I took your shit and did stuff with it, but I'm already wearing it now so you don't mind do you?"

Uh, I'm pretty sure you'd fucking mind.

The same can be said for these stories that are recorded without asking.

It's not hard to ask for permission. You send an email or a PM or drop a line and you ask and whatever that person says, whether it's yay or nay or you sure you don't want to use another story, you do, because that's part of what fandom is about: respecting other people. It's about respecting other people's choices, even when you don't agree and they make you sad or irate or frustrated, and not trying to harangue an author when you didn't even have the decency to ask in the first place and then being upset and acting like a dick when that person says no.

We all want fandom to be a place we can come and hang out and be happy and feel respected and understood and appreciated. That all starts at home, it starts with manners and treating people the way you want to be treated. I want to be treated like a human being with thoughts and feelings and consideration. And I think you do, too.

I mean unless you want me at your house when you come home, chilling on your sofa, drinking your beer and wearing your favorite hat. I would even buy my own ticket if your name is Raylan Givens. Just saying.

Please do not link to metafandom

Comments

[wordsalone.livejournal.com]

♥

[svilleficrecs.livejournal.com]

<3

And also, if you felt compelled to write ANY fic with Raylan (and at the moment I'm feeling some Raylan/Tim though I'm not sure how it would work) I would be eternally your bitch, and also promise to never podfic it.

[anywherebeyond.livejournal.com]

*hugs* I'm sorry about the closet raiders, boo.

[sparky77.livejournal.com]

I mean unless you want me at your house when you come home, chilling on your sofa, drinking your beer and wearing your favorite hat.

You are more than welcome :)

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

You're reminding me of a conversation I had with a fangirl who could not comprehend that it was a problem that she was converting other people's fic to e-book reader formats that she could then share with the world.

She was completely convinced that (1) the fic was public domain and therefore hers to play with, and (2) she was providing an awesome service (for which she was starting comms and contemplating fees).

I was very proud I didn't punch her in the face.

[alethialia.livejournal.com]

...wow.

That's...well, that's something. I don't even know what to say.

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

You mean, not sure what to say in to response to my reaction, or to her opinion?

(I hope that doesn't sound defensive...I'm actually just curious how my original comment is perceived because I almost didn't post it.)

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

Never mind. My own words were making me uncomfortable. Even if they didn't bother you, I apologize for including that last sentence. It was unkind and inappropriate.

[alethialia.livejournal.com]

My comment was in response to her sentiment, which I find, um, rather amazing. I certainly appreciate that you related the story and had no problem with your comment.

[bibliokat.livejournal.com]

I guess I can kinda see where she thinks that converting fic and sharing it is ok, but once she brought money into it, HELL NO! NOT HERS.

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

Personally, I prefer to err on the side of being too polite and to ask before doing anything other than bookmark the location of someone else's work.

For example, I've learned that some authors love being archived in new locations; others really feel uncomfortable and would prefer that things stay on their own sites. I think the same emotions may apply to having one's work recorded as podfic, or converted to e-reader formats without one's knowledge.

It's a sensitive topic, which is why I should have been more careful with my words. I'm sorry that I included that last sentence in my original comment.

[bunnymcfoo.livejournal.com]

Huh. I save things onto my own computer all the time, but I don't think it would ever really occur to me to share those files with others unless it had clearly been stated as being okay.

I just - some people's children.

[bibliokat.livejournal.com]

I agree with you. I wouldn't dare do something with someone else's work without permission too.

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

I think this is only acceptable with explicit permission. And please don't get me started on the for-profit angle. I (and I would say 99.5% of us do this for love. Profiting is NOT COOL).

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

I am in awe. I read your comment five times to make sure I didn't miss something, but no, it says what I think it says. I'm not a fan of the e-book business either, but to believe that someone else's fic was hers to do what she wanted TO MAKE A PROFIT.

Fandom is not for profit.

That's like rule #1.

Asking permission?

Rule #2.

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

It was a boggling conversation, but sadly she didn't really see the problem.

Also, hi, I'm Ten. We met peripherally once through mutual friends. I'm not sure I've ever actually commented here before, and I'm offline more than on, but I do enjoy your point of view.

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

She didn't see the problem. *pauses* Does this person write stories in fandom? I just can't fathom that one writer would do that to another writer. Then again, people constantly gall me so what do I know.

In less baffling conversation, Hello! I appreciate you stopping by. :)

[tenaciousmetoo.livejournal.com]

She does write, yes. But I see that her archive sites now state in boldface text that all fics are posted with permission by the author, so perhaps she has learned something in the past few years. One can hope.

[alethialia.livejournal.com]

Just WORD to all of this. Common friggin' decency does not go out the window simply because it's the 'net. And frankly, if you're asking after the fact then you damn well know you should be asking beforehand...but you're not. Which makes you kind of a jerk.

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

That was the other point I'd meant to put in here! Just because nobody can see you being a dick on the internet does not mean you're not being a dick. And it doesn't excuse it either.

[forsweatervests.livejournal.com]

Word.

[bibliokat.livejournal.com]

Manners and Justified quote for the win.

[bunnymcfoo.livejournal.com]

ugh. seriously, some people lack manners.

[snarkaddict.livejournal.com]

That is just plain rude! What is wrong with people?!

In happier news, I love that moment when Raylan said that! ♥

[live-laugh-love.livejournal.com]

wow. that's some balls right there. ill mannered ones at that.

[ariadne83]

How would you feel if I came to your house while you were out and took some of your jewelry or your shirts or your favorite shoes and wore them around and then came back later when you were home and said, "Oh, hai! I took your shit and did stuff with it, but I'm already wearing it now so you don't mind do you?"

My little sister used to do this all the time and it drove me NUTS. To this day I obsessively alphabetize my CDs because I have to know exactly what's missing.

[niciasus.livejournal.com]

Those people are stealing, pure and simple. I'm amazed at what technology has done to people. It has desensitized people and their moral landscape. If they see something on the net, in the community such as in fandom, they think they own it. I just don't get it.

[sheara121.livejournal.com]

damn. it never even occurred to me that people could be so rude.

[daraq.livejournal.com]

I didn't know that you have a strict no-podfic policy. I download almost everything I see, but won't take any of your stories if I run across them in the future. I'm glad you got this out before you exploded - it's good for the rest of us to know what's going on in this kind of situation.

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

Have you come across my stories being podficced, because I have not given anyone permission to do so?

[daraq.livejournal.com]

I looked through my files and didn't find anything, but will let you know if I see any of your stories posted on a podfic community.

[factorielle.livejournal.com]

Er. Much as I agree that it should be basic courtesy to ask for these things, two points:

1. In terms of how it affects you, I don't see the difference between asking before or after recording. If they're graceful about the fact that they took a risk and lost, then it's fundamentally the same thing. The only difference is that they've wasted hours on work that will never see the day, but that's their problem. If they're not graceful about it, which the person mentioned up there wasn't, then it's something else entirely. But on principle, why should someone ask for permission before starting to record something that may never be finished?

2. The "what you're doing is the same as breaking into my house and stealing my belongings" argument is as fallacious here as it is in the hands of the anti-fanfiction crowd. How does making a recording of a fictional work (that's already based on someone else's to begin with, so there's a healthy dose of irony) equate to trespassing and theft?

[hackthis.livejournal.com]

With regards to your first point I'll c-n-p from what I said twice in my post:

This is about the people who go ahead and record somebody else's story and then ask after the fact if it's cool if they post them since they already appropriated somebody else's work without permission and now they've got this story that they just have to share since they did all this work and they badger the author to give them permission even though they never asked permission in the first fucking place.


It's not hard to ask for permission. You send an email or a PM or drop a line and you ask and whatever that person says, whether it's yay or nay or you sure you don't want to use another story, you do, because that's part of what fandom is about: respecting other people. It's about respecting other people's choices, even when you don't agree and they make you sad or irate or frustrated, and not trying to harangue an author when you didn't even have the decency to ask in the first place and then being upset and acting like a dick when that person says no.


My issue here is pressuring the author to let them release the audiofic when they didn't ask for permission in the first place. Frankly, you can ask before or you can ask after, but using the fact that the story has already been record to back the author into saying yes? Not okay. Now some people are okay with saying no anyway, some people feel unable to say no, because they're being hounded, that's where my problem lies. I shouldn't feel bad about saying "no."

As for your second point, I have no doubt that I could've come up with a better comparison, but I didn't. Thankfully this is an opinion piece and not a dissertation.

[bl-nt.livejournal.com]

aaah total off topic, but you guys that write GK fics are awesome.the talent THE TALENT ..I just love you O_O

[freedomyell.livejournal.com]

you are so right.
I hope you don't mind me commenting randomly like this.
BTW - why do you not want this linked to metafandom?
I've just never heard of metafandom before thought for some reason I think of huge Japanese Robots!